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Author Topic: The occult was being taught to us as children

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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#30: May 24, 2021, 09:09:21 AM
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Thus Lucifer/Prometheus being a deceiver, eh?
I'll admit, it's difficult at times to change the dial between here and other places. Having to put more effort in to thinking about what you guys are talking about is still alluring to me, even after a couple of years of lurking around.

See but like... you're the one saying lucifer is the deceiver. Who rewrote and perverted the Bible? Was it slammin' sammy?
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#31: May 24, 2021, 11:18:09 PM
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Thus Lucifer/Prometheus being a deceiver, eh?
I'll admit, it's difficult at times to change the dial between here and other places. Having to put more effort in to thinking about what you guys are talking about is still alluring to me, even after a couple of years of lurking around.

See but like... you're the one saying lucifer is the deceiver. Who rewrote and perverted the Bible? Was it slammin' sammy?

Is the Trickster not a manifestation of Lucifer?
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#32: May 25, 2021, 03:36:06 AM
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Thus Lucifer/Prometheus being a deceiver, eh?
I'll admit, it's difficult at times to change the dial between here and other places. Having to put more effort in to thinking about what you guys are talking about is still alluring to me, even after a couple of years of lurking around.

See but like... you're the one saying lucifer is the deceiver. Who rewrote and perverted the Bible? Was it slammin' sammy?

Is the Trickster not a manifestation of Lucifer?

Actually no. Lucifer is not Satan. Satan isn't. Even Satan, Satan is a title. That which we think of as Satan is really Hermes
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#33: June 07, 2021, 02:45:56 AM
I don't think "Satan" is the Trickster. I was never under that impression. I understand the title means "adversary".
Wasn't one of the big points of the Promethean Myth his deception of Zeus? Prometheus feels like the shining example of the Lucifer title. The Serpent in the Garden was also a Trickster, no? Didn't he deceive El (Anu)?

How does "Satan" connect to Hermes? I'm not following and I'm assuming there's context I'm missing.
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#34: June 07, 2021, 02:55:31 AM
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Apologies if I missed something but who exactly is Jack supposed to be?

No need to apologize, we are all here to learn. The name Jack is often used to name trickster and a thief. And at the end of this story, a carrier of light.

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This is what really confused me. A carrier of light at the end of his story? How does this mesh with Nick suggesting that Jack is supposed to be a "Jewish" thief? I'm having trouble reconciling carrier of light and jack also being conniving and malevolent.
Was I just not understanding Nick to be cynical?

Why do you think.of light as positive?

What was the default state of the universe

I think I'm taking a personification angle. I understand what you're suggesting: "Light" means knowledge here.
But, yeah, contrast is what really animates things. What is Light without Darkness?

More importantly, stripped of stigma,  what do the vast number of humans find more instinctively comforting, safe and tranquil


And to which are we conditioned to flock toward in times of uncertainty, such as right after death?

So, Jack carries Light (Lucifer), but a false Light. Does this not make him a deceiver?
I understand what you guys are pointing toward with the primordial darkness concept, "Let there be Light". Sure. But these two concepts seem to contradict to me, especially in light of the previous post I've made.
I'm not sure what I'm missing here.
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#35: June 07, 2021, 03:22:13 AM
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Apologies if I missed something but who exactly is Jack supposed to be?

No need to apologize, we are all here to learn. The name Jack is often used to name trickster and a thief. And at the end of this story, a carrier of light.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

This is what really confused me. A carrier of light at the end of his story? How does this mesh with Nick suggesting that Jack is supposed to be a "Jewish" thief? I'm having trouble reconciling carrier of light and jack also being conniving and malevolent.
Was I just not understanding Nick to be cynical?

Why do you think.of light as positive?

What was the default state of the universe

I think I'm taking a personification angle. I understand what you're suggesting: "Light" means knowledge here.
But, yeah, contrast is what really animates things. What is Light without Darkness?

More importantly, stripped of stigma,  what do the vast number of humans find more instinctively comforting, safe and tranquil


And to which are we conditioned to flock toward in times of uncertainty, such as right after death?

So, Jack carries Light (Lucifer), but a false Light. Does this not make him a deceiver?
I understand what you guys are pointing toward with the primordial darkness concept, "Let there be Light". Sure. But these two concepts seem to contradict to me, especially in light of the previous post I've made.
I'm not sure what I'm missing here.

So... why is the light false
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The occult was being taught to us as children
#36: June 07, 2021, 03:27:19 AM
darkness was the original state, we weren't the original inhabitants here, we arrived here with the arrival of light? maybe there's two types of light and knowledge? one light that binds us to the illussion and one that helps you break free from it?
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#37: June 07, 2021, 04:01:45 AM
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Apologies if I missed something but who exactly is Jack supposed to be?

No need to apologize, we are all here to learn. The name Jack is often used to name trickster and a thief. And at the end of this story, a carrier of light.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

This is what really confused me. A carrier of light at the end of his story? How does this mesh with Nick suggesting that Jack is supposed to be a "Jewish" thief? I'm having trouble reconciling carrier of light and jack also being conniving and malevolent.
Was I just not understanding Nick to be cynical?

Why do you think.of light as positive?

What was the default state of the universe

I think I'm taking a personification angle. I understand what you're suggesting: "Light" means knowledge here.
But, yeah, contrast is what really animates things. What is Light without Darkness?

More importantly, stripped of stigma,  what do the vast number of humans find more instinctively comforting, safe and tranquil


And to which are we conditioned to flock toward in times of uncertainty, such as right after death?

So, Jack carries Light (Lucifer), but a false Light. Does this not make him a deceiver?
I understand what you guys are pointing toward with the primordial darkness concept, "Let there be Light". Sure. But these two concepts seem to contradict to me, especially in light of the previous post I've made.
I'm not sure what I'm missing here.

So... why is the light false

I understand it wasn't the Divine Light of Sophia, but of Yaldaboath.
Yet, Sophia implanted that very light in Seth, deceiving the Demiurge. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to perceive the delineation you're making when you're being laconic. Is it because we were talking about Jack being a "Jewish" archetype (connection to the Demiurge)? Still, do both aspects of "Light carrier"s not have an embedded facet of deception?
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#38: June 07, 2021, 04:27:16 AM
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Apologies if I missed something but who exactly is Jack supposed to be?

No need to apologize, we are all here to learn. The name Jack is often used to name trickster and a thief. And at the end of this story, a carrier of light.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

This is what really confused me. A carrier of light at the end of his story? How does this mesh with Nick suggesting that Jack is supposed to be a "Jewish" thief? I'm having trouble reconciling carrier of light and jack also being conniving and malevolent.
Was I just not understanding Nick to be cynical?

Why do you think.of light as positive?

What was the default state of the universe

I think I'm taking a personification angle. I understand what you're suggesting: "Light" means knowledge here.
But, yeah, contrast is what really animates things. What is Light without Darkness?

More importantly, stripped of stigma,  what do the vast number of humans find more instinctively comforting, safe and tranquil


And to which are we conditioned to flock toward in times of uncertainty, such as right after death?

So, Jack carries Light (Lucifer), but a false Light. Does this not make him a deceiver?
I understand what you guys are pointing toward with the primordial darkness concept, "Let there be Light". Sure. But these two concepts seem to contradict to me, especially in light of the previous post I've made.
I'm not sure what I'm missing here.

So... why is the light false

I understand it wasn't the Divine Light of Sophia, but of Yaldaboath.
Yet, Sophia implanted that very light in Seth, deceiving the Demiurge. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to perceive the delineation you're making when you're being laconic. Is it because we were talking about Jack being a "Jewish" archetype (connection to the Demiurge)? Still, do both aspects of "Light carrier"s not have an embedded facet of deception?

Dude...

"I like apples"

"I get it the apple is symbolic of temptation and the temptations sang, so you're saying to sing"

Don't make leaps, take steps
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#39: June 07, 2021, 05:27:12 AM
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Apologies if I missed something but who exactly is Jack supposed to be?

No need to apologize, we are all here to learn. The name Jack is often used to name trickster and a thief. And at the end of this story, a carrier of light.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

This is what really confused me. A carrier of light at the end of his story? How does this mesh with Nick suggesting that Jack is supposed to be a "Jewish" thief? I'm having trouble reconciling carrier of light and jack also being conniving and malevolent.
Was I just not understanding Nick to be cynical?

Why do you think.of light as positive?

What was the default state of the universe

I think I'm taking a personification angle. I understand what you're suggesting: "Light" means knowledge here.
But, yeah, contrast is what really animates things. What is Light without Darkness?

More importantly, stripped of stigma,  what do the vast number of humans find more instinctively comforting, safe and tranquil


And to which are we conditioned to flock toward in times of uncertainty, such as right after death?

So, Jack carries Light (Lucifer), but a false Light. Does this not make him a deceiver?
I understand what you guys are pointing toward with the primordial darkness concept, "Let there be Light". Sure. But these two concepts seem to contradict to me, especially in light of the previous post I've made.
I'm not sure what I'm missing here.

So... why is the light false

The light is false because our reality is an illusion or maybe our reality is an illusion because light is false in and of itself its nature is to deceive. If everything is just various forms of light that are parsed through our vision with our Luciferian eyes then there truly is nothing 'real' or not deceptive about the light.

Who or when was it that claimed light was anything other than deceptive? Who claimed it was anything similar or even being 'the truth'?

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The occult was being taught to us as children
#40: June 07, 2021, 05:29:12 AM
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darkness was the original state, we weren't the original inhabitants here, we arrived here with the arrival of light? maybe there's two types of light and knowledge? one light that binds us to the illussion and one that helps you break free from it?

Some would say we are light but that would mean we are probably void of darkness. Isn't there always a shadow following you when you stand in the light?

We are neither 'Light' or 'Darkness' we are something 'in-between'. 'The originals' were 'darkness' itself apparently and the others that Creator made were literally made of 'light'. We are something special, we are neither yet are composed of both at least on some level it would appear to be the case.
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« Last Edit: June 07, 2021, 05:30:58 AM by The Watchers 2.0 »

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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#41: June 07, 2021, 05:47:27 AM
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Apologies if I missed something but who exactly is Jack supposed to be?

No need to apologize, we are all here to learn. The name Jack is often used to name trickster and a thief. And at the end of this story, a carrier of light.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

This is what really confused me. A carrier of light at the end of his story? How does this mesh with Nick suggesting that Jack is supposed to be a "Jewish" thief? I'm having trouble reconciling carrier of light and jack also being conniving and malevolent.
Was I just not understanding Nick to be cynical?

Why do you think.of light as positive?

What was the default state of the universe

I think I'm taking a personification angle. I understand what you're suggesting: "Light" means knowledge here.
But, yeah, contrast is what really animates things. What is Light without Darkness?

More importantly, stripped of stigma,  what do the vast number of humans find more instinctively comforting, safe and tranquil


And to which are we conditioned to flock toward in times of uncertainty, such as right after death?

So, Jack carries Light (Lucifer), but a false Light. Does this not make him a deceiver?
I understand what you guys are pointing toward with the primordial darkness concept, "Let there be Light". Sure. But these two concepts seem to contradict to me, especially in light of the previous post I've made.
I'm not sure what I'm missing here.

So... why is the light false

I understand it wasn't the Divine Light of Sophia, but of Yaldaboath.
Yet, Sophia implanted that very light in Seth, deceiving the Demiurge. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to perceive the delineation you're making when you're being laconic. Is it because we were talking about Jack being a "Jewish" archetype (connection to the Demiurge)? Still, do both aspects of "Light carrier"s not have an embedded facet of deception?

There is no such thing as 'Divine Light' there is merely the wielder and their intent and in this case its 'Sophia' the entity that fell on some grand level and initiated some large part of humanity into a new age of ignorance (to keep things simple).

If Darkness is the true natural state of the universe then why is it that 'Light' is 'divine'? Why is the Darkness not divine instead? Why don't we hear about 'divine Darkness' instead?
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The occult was being taught to us as children
#42: June 07, 2021, 07:58:17 AM
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Yet, Sophia implanted that very light in Seth, deceiving the Demiurge. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to perceive the delineation you're making when you're being laconic. Is it because we were talking about Jack being a "Jewish" archetype (connection to the Demiurge)? Still, do both aspects of "Light carrier"s not have an embedded facet of deception?

FWIW I think the issue of Satan was brought up to show how polarized expectations can ensnare our learning of these concepts. If they have us filling the wrong blanks we’ll never notice the right answers. Religions don’t arm us with the correct slots for the cosmic shapes, after (((rewrites))) they arm us with slots that will actively refuse those shapes.

Take the Demiurge for example, the Greeks assigned that title to a planet, simple as that, but the Gnostic hijack formed such a polarized story around that title, made it so evil, good luck fitting any shape through the Demiurge slot anymore. They created a ‘blank’ that doesn’t exist, there’s no ‘answer’ because any real demiurge is nothing like the Gnostic story describes.

That’s one immediate example of the above. The Demiurge isn’t Jewish, the rewrite convincing us he’s an evil deity opposed to Mankind is Jewish. Lucifer isn’t deceptive, the rewrite convincing us he has ill intent is deceptive... etc.
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« Last Edit: June 07, 2021, 08:03:05 AM by ephemeron »
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The occult was being taught to us as children
#43: June 07, 2021, 12:41:00 PM
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Yet, Sophia implanted that very light in Seth, deceiving the Demiurge. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to perceive the delineation you're making when you're being laconic. Is it because we were talking about Jack being a "Jewish" archetype (connection to the Demiurge)? Still, do both aspects of "Light carrier"s not have an embedded facet of deception?

FWIW I think the issue of Satan was brought up to show how polarized expectations can ensnare our learning of these concepts. If they have us filling the wrong blanks we’ll never notice the right answers. Religions don’t arm us with the correct slots for the cosmic shapes, after (((rewrites))) they arm us with slots that will actively refuse those shapes.

Take the Demiurge for example, the Greeks assigned that title to a planet, simple as that, but the Gnostic hijack formed such a polarized story around that title, made it so evil, good luck fitting any shape through the Demiurge slot anymore. They created a ‘blank’ that doesn’t exist, there’s no ‘answer’ because any real demiurge is nothing like the Gnostic story describes.

That’s one immediate example of the above. The Demiurge isn’t Jewish, the rewrite convincing us he’s an evil deity opposed to Mankind is Jewish. Lucifer isn’t deceptive, the rewrite convincing us he has ill intent is deceptive... etc.

What is the known etymology of 'demiurge'?

Quote
demiurge (n.)
1670s, from Latinized form of Greek dēmiourgos, literally "public or skilled worker, worker for the people," from dēmos "common people" (see demotic) + ergos "work," from PIE root *werg- "to do."

A little recent as far as 'old etymologies' go but still, if this is the case then why is the 'public/skilled worker for the people' the villainized?
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Re: The occult was being taught to us as children
#44: June 07, 2021, 09:07:23 PM
just watched this interview with an exorcist.
he touches on some of these topics.
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